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"Comment on Art and Elitism: A Form of Pattern Recognition by bill ..." posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2008-10-30 08:45:05

Can you tell a dog from a cat by just looking at photographs? I am sure you can – even a four-year-old can. You can do it even when some dog breeds may have lot more in common to a cat than other kinds of dogs. Take a for example. Compare this to a and say a. A pekingese is a lot closer to a typical house cat in size shape shape of the head fur and yet none of us would mistake it for a cat.  Now that we know how to distinguish a cat from a dog let’s try to write down the rules in plain English so that some unfortunate fellow who has never seen a cat or a dog can identify one. That’s where the trouble starts. Even though our brain knows how to do this classification our conscious mind is often incapable of articulating the rules. Our brain is exceptionally good at this type of task. We are amazing machines. Our animal brains have evolved to do just this with exceptional accuracy. Given a set of examples of any class of objects we can form internal rules through which we can classify a new entity as either a member of a class or not. When we learn to read we are shown many examples of the letter “A,” both hand written and printed and at some point we discover the rule and can positively identify an “A” from all other letters even though each hand-written “A” is really unique. The task becomes easier when we are shown not only members of a class but also examples of nonmembers. We are not only shown examples of “A,” but also examples of all non-A letters.   Things get even more interesting and complex when we learn to classify more abstract things like moral good from bad. All our childhood stories are full of examples of good and bad acts good and bad people and our brain catalogs each until it discovers the rules of how to decide. Later in life when we come across a new situation or a new person we apply these rules and label them as such. We all have slightly different internal rules and hence the difference in our moral compass.  Exactly the same thing happens with our perception of art. As we come across paintings sculptures stories poems music cinema we are told where they stand in terms of quality. When we hear of a novel we are told if it is a “classic.” When we go to a museum we are told that these are examples of some of the best of the breed. Even before we can decide whether we like or not we are informed that he is one of the best we have ever produced. It is impossible for us not to use our pattern-recognition machine in these situations as well – we are programmed to do so – our survival depends on successful and efficient pattern recognition.  True good art often has the ability to move us emotionally or convey a new message but how can we be sure that this response isn’t simply a learned reaction? Appreciating any complex piece of art requires training. It is generally not the case that folks fall in love with. Picasso or unless they have spent a considerable amount to time with classical music modern painting or “good” literature. Is it not possible that what we call artistic training is essentially training for pattern classification?  Now let’s take it a step further. If I have trained myself to appreciate modern art by experiencing it a lot and if my brain is good at that sort of thing then I’ll form rules for discerning what I was told was “good” art and distinguishing it from the “bad.” Now when I visit a gallery to see the work of a new artist. I will apply my rules of “good” and “bad” art and make my judgment on whether this new artist is any good. Since most of the other visitors have also been trained by similar examples of “good” and “bad” art their opinions will often be similar to mine and the new artist will be branded accordingly.  The same logic can be extended to the creators themselves. If I decide to become an artist myself. I will judge my own work by the same abstract rules of “good” and “bad” and produce art that passes my own judgment. Therefore once it is established that some works are examples of good art it almost guarantees that the pattern will be perpetuated by future artists and critics.  Of course there is something more than just pattern recognition here but is there any way for us to ever separate the two? Since there is no observer here who can be outside of the system we can never know to what extent my preference is biased by the pattern-classification training I received in the past. One may argue that we can take someone with no exposure to a particular type of art as an independent subject but that’s not really feasible. Every art form is also a language in itself and without some training and exposure one cannot learn how to read that language. There’s an anecdote about a rich woman who once approached Picasso during one of his shows and told him. “Mr. Picasso. I really do not understand your art.” Picasso replied. “Madame do you know Chinese?” Puzzled she replied “No.” Picasso said. “but Chinese can be learnt.”  How will we ever know the true difference between elitism perpetuated through pattern recognition and the intrinsic value of a piece of art? Is it even a valid question to which we can ever expect to get a meaningful answer?  I think you made a mistake when you went from “dog” and “cat” to “moral good from bad” and then to “art” in confusing three DIFFERENT types of patterns. “dog” and “cat” is fairly constant. “moral good from bad” is somewhat variable - as in for example what was considered improper sexuality over the centuries. “art” is even more subjective - what we regard as great art today was often considered mere popular culture at the time it was created. Robert Louis Stevenson once wrote that “the purpose of any art is to make a pattern”. Perhaps part of the beauty of art is simply the joy of discovering these patterns which others have planted. As far as merit is concerned beauty will always be in the eye of the beholder. However as you say elitism is based only indirectly on merit and more on the basis of previous peoples’ opinions of what is good or bad. Nevertheless the “first” people to say that Picasso’s/Beethoven’s/etc work was brilliant whose praises we now all copy were probably relying on their personal taste; so we should do the same. Moreover it is art that persons of ordinary sensibility like me reject out of hand irrespective of what the current rules may dictate. So there’s something else going on here. Seth. Georgios and Bob all of you raised somewhat similar doubts about my logic. I must first admit that what I said is no more than a conjecture which seemed to make sense to me. Having said that let me try to respond to some of the questions. Seth. I agree they are three very different kinds of patterns but my choice was deliberate. I do not believe that we have specific mechanisms in our brain to deal with different types of patterns but rather a very powerful and general mechanism that can adapt to recognize all types of patterns that life throws at us. (As a side note my doctoral dissertation tried to show that the same pattern recognition mechanism can also be used to find “patterns” in the pattern-rules we have previously discovered and this can lead to the heuristics that we use to solve other problems — pulling oneself with the bootstrap). Our classification rules change based on our experience whether it is morality or art. The moral framework that you and I may share is probably very different from a Victorian person because we are exposed to a very different set of examples of what is “good” and “bad”. This becomes even clearer when it comes to art. As Bob pointed out the “rules” are constantly changing. However artistic styles generally does not change abruptly but rather makes relatively smooth transitions. Pollock could not have been appreciated in the times of Monet and Monet could not have been appreciated during Renaissance. If I am trained by a certain set of examples of “good” art then I can probably deviate a little from there but not a whole lot. That is my pattern recognition mechanism would allow me to tweak it a little but not drastically. Therefore as an art lover from the 15th century my aesthetic rules would not be able to extend to include the works of Monet. In other words the fact that styles change slowly supports my assertion. What is also interesting is that the model is cumulative. Standing at any point in history we can “appreciate” all the artistic styles that preceded it. Every generation is exposed to more examples of “good” art and our model expands accordingly. Of course we apply our personal taste and judgment on top of all this and I am not at all diminishing the intrinsic emotional value captured in good art. To answer Georgios point about the “first” fans of Beethoven — I am not sure they did that judgment in vacuum. Their aesthetic sensibility was tuned by what they were trained to like and Beethoven introduced something new but not as new as Stravinsky. That is it was something their pattern recognition model could accommodate and at the same time be thrilled by its originality beauty and emotional appeal. We all rely on our personal taste and we will continue to do so but it is also worth asking the question what factors influence our personal taste. How will we ever know the true difference between elitism perpetuated through pattern recognition and the intrinsic value of a piece of art? Is it even a valid question to which we can ever expect to get a meaningful answer?” Kunal if your first assertion above is correct i e. “there is no observer here who can be outside of the system”. I think you are absolutely correct in your conclusion. Without someone who can “step outside of the system” and give us an idea of what may constitute an acceptable standard or plumb line. I don’t think we can distinugish between what our own trained and influenced “pattern recognition” finds beautiful and valuable and the intrinsic value of a piece of art. Here. I also think Bob has raised some very good points and questions above which I don’t think you have really given a satisfactory response to. The big question I have for you however is how confident are you of that first assertion and what do you think anything could ever change your mind? What do you think would need to be involved? Appreciation of art is possibly one of the most complex things that our brain does so it would be absurd to think that pattern recognition is the only mechanism behind it. All I am claiming is that it is possibly one of the many factors but it would be very difficult for us to find out the magnitude of its influence on our artistic perceptions. Nathan to answer your question. I really do not see how we can ever test this hypothesis. However. I am no more than a curious observer publicly discussing something that I found intriguing. I am sure there are people out there who can approach this problem from a more scholarly standpoint and I would love to know what they think. Regarding Bob’s example of a preserved shark as an object of art — here a very different measure of artistic validity is at play. Appreciation of conceptual art like this which gain importance by the originality of the underlying idea also forms its own pattern class. However as an individual. I may reject the whole notion of this type of art and therefore never allow my brain to incorporate this pattern into my existing set of rules that I use to classify “good” art. Georgios. I totally agree with you that for certain types of art discovering the structural pattern is where the joy is. This becomes more important as the art gets more abstract. Music is possibly one of the most abstract forms of art and here discovery of the mathematical pattern becomes a huge part of the reward and enjoyment. With simple tunes the patterns are simpler they are easier to decode and hence easier to like but also easier to get bored with. Complex structures in classical music is much harder to decode and therefore needs extended exposure before we can start enjoying it but once we do the joy is deeper and each time we listen to it our brain discovers new structures and the enjoyment lasts for ever. It is a bit surprising that trying to understand why I like art does not diminish my enjoyment of it in any way. If anything it makes it more mysterious and attractive. To me art is the ultimate celebration of the most complex and fascinating thing in the universe – our mind. This tiny mass of tissue has the power to comprehend all the complexities of the whole universe and yet can’t fully figure out why we like what we like. Also - when you speak of the “shark art” and its “*very different* measure of artistic validity” - going on to say that an indivual may not recognize it as “good” art… are you trying to convey that this judgment of theirs may well be true but you do not see how we could ever know for sure? Correct me if I am wrong. Nathan thank you very much for assuring me that this is not all nonsense because honestly speaking. I wasn’t so sure. I have no formal qualification to say all the things that I am saying and apart from reflecting on these questions. I cannot claim that I did any real research on the topic. Therefore my arguments are based not on what others have said about it but only on my own logical analysis. That’s why I believe that experts must have already discussed this issue and there may even be some sort of accepted conclusions. Now let me try to answer your original question based purely on my logic and nothing else. As I said before any complex art form requires training before one can appreciate it. Knowing how to read does not prepare one to appreciate modern poetry or having a pair of ears is not enough to enjoy classical music. Some art forms may be more accessible than others but without adequate exposure one cannot learn the “language” or the basic grammar of that art form. This “training” need not necessarily involve a “tutor” but requires the exposure to a large variety of examples of that art form. Therefore it is conceivable to do our experiment by taking someone who has no exposure to a given art form show plenty of examples (which must include not just the famous examples but a much wider spectrum) and then check if this individual’s evaluation of specific pieces roughly agrees with the rest of the expert community. The problem is in reality it would be very difficult to isolate these examples from the pre-existing value judgment. The fact that the author of the book received the Nobel Prize or that a certain painting is displayed in a major museum would inevitably start providing clues about the pre-existing ranking and start the process of pattern recognition. As I said before there is of course the issue of liking a piece of art because of the inherent quality of that piece. A piece of music can have a complex pattern and the joy of decoding that could be independent of anything else. A novel may touch a chord in my personal life. A representational painting can evoke nostalgia. An abstract painting can appeal to my visual sense of symmetry and balance. An interesting departure of this is when you look at contemporary conceptual art where context becomes so important that it is almost impossible to judge it outside of that context. Take Ad Reinhardt’s “black paintings” that he did during the 50’s and 60’s. These almost nearly uniform black canvases adorn the walls of most major museums. However if I paint a black canvas like that today. I will have no chance of getting it selected for even a minor show. This proves that the value of that style is only relevant in its historical context and devoid of that it looses its meaning. But this and the “shark art” can be the topic of another essay because that is another area that intrigues me a lot. I am not sure I answered your question or not. If not then may be we should limit our discussion to a narrower range – may be just abstract painting or just classical music. Each art form has its own distinctive attributes and may be combining them all under one umbrella is making the logic more dense and confusing us. I am not sure if you understood what I was getting at. My major question for you simply dealt with the issue of whether there could be an observer outside the system who could *even begin* to give us a standard by which we could judge the “inherent quality” of the art in a way that goes beyond - transcends - our own varying subjective impressions. Tacit and subjective impressions aside when we get around to eaplicitly talking about what is really real art can we say anything that is ever universal for human beings? As a Christian of course I think there is. And I think Gene Edward Veith’s books about art are very thought-provoking (look in worldcat org under his name). If you are an artist who also believes that all manner of empirical research is valuable and might be able to have some real significance on the way we view the world. I suggest the work by John Warwick Montgomery “Tractatus Logico-Theologicus” (via Amazon) (as he endeavors to show why its reasonable to believe that there is indeed someone “outside the system” who could provide us a meaningful plumb-line that is not utterly self-fixated). By the way when you say. “As I said before any complex art form requires training before one can appreciate it. Knowing how to read does not prepare one to appreciate modern poetry or having a pair of ears is not enough to enjoy classical music”. I recall the works of the scientist-philosopher Michael Polanyi. With remaining a realist about the world “out there”. Polanyi said that something very similar to what you’ve said above was actually true about great scientists as well. I suggest his works as well. You do leave me puzzled though. In stating that you are a certain atheist. I am not sure how you can really consistently talk about “inherent quality” - am I to assume you are using this pharase in a more or less utilitarian fashion i e something that “could be interpreted as profitable for man’s comfort or useful in the universal battle for survival” (Schumacher. A Guide for the Perplexed)? Not that man’s comfort or survival aren’t important but how useful are these words you are using really when your choice of art may not be profitable to my comfort? Can you see how this would be misleading? Perhaps you should find a turn of phrase that would better express the subjective / limited nature of your view.

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http://blogs.britannica.com/blog/main/2007/11/art-and-elitism-a-form-of-pattern-recognition/#comment-232736

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"Comment on Art and Elitism: A Form of Pattern Recognition by Kunal Sen" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2008-09-13 21:56:24

Can you tell a dog from a cat by just looking at photographs? I am sure you can – even a four-year-old can. You can do it even when some dog breeds may have lot more in common to a cat than other kinds of dogs. Take a for example. Compare this to a and say a. A pekingese is a lot closer to a typical accommodate cat in size shape shape of the head fur and yet none of us would mistake it for a cat.  Now that we know how to identify a cat from a dog let’s try to write down the rules in plain English so that some unfortunate fellow who has never seen a cat or a dog can determine one. That’s where the affect starts. Even though our brain knows how to do this classification our conscious mind is often incapable of articulating the rules. Our brain is exceptionally good at this write of task. We are amazing machines. Our animal brains have evolved to do just this with exceptional accuracy. Given a set of examples of any class of objects we can create internal rules through which we can classify a new entity as either a member of a class or not. When we learn to read we are shown many examples of the letter “A,” both hand written and printed and at some point we discover the rule and can positively identify an “A” from all other letters even though each hand-written “A” is really unique. The task becomes easier when we are shown not only members of a class but also examples of nonmembers. We are not only shown examples of “A,” but also examples of all non-A letters.   Things get change surface more interesting and complex when we learn to classify more abstract things like moral good from bad. All our childhood stories are full of examples of good and bad acts good and bad populate and our brain catalogs each until it discovers the rules of how to decide. Later in life when we come across a new situation or a new person we bear on these rules and label them as such. We all have slightly different internal rules and hence the difference in our moral compass.  Exactly the same thing happens with our perception of art. As we come across paintings sculptures stories poems music cinema we are told where they rest in terms of quality. When we comprehend of a novel we are told if it is a “classic.” When we go to a museum we are told that these are examples of some of the best of the cause. change surface before we can end whether we like or not we are informed that he is one of the beat we undergo ever produced. It is impossible for us not to use our pattern-recognition machine in these situations as well – we are programmed to do so – our survival depends on successful and efficient pattern recognition.  True good art often has the ability to act us emotionally or convey a new communicate but how can we be sure that this response isn’t simply a learned reaction? Appreciating any complex conjoin of art requires training. It is generally not the case that folks fall in love with. Picasso or unless they have spent a considerable amount to time with classical music modern painting or “good” literature. Is it not possible that what we call artistic training is essentially training for pattern classification?  Now let’s take it a step advance. If I have trained myself to appreciate modern art by experiencing it a lot and if my brain is good at that choose of thing then I’ll form rules for discerning what I was told was “good” art and distinguishing it from the “bad.” Now when I visit a gallery to see the work of a new artist. I will apply my rules of “good” and “bad” art and alter my judgment on whether this new artist is any good. Since most of the other visitors have also been trained by similar examples of “good” and “bad” art their opinions will often be similar to mine and the new artist will be branded accordingly.  The same logic can be extended to the creators themselves. If I decide to become an artist myself. I will judge my own work by the same abstract rules of “good” and “bad” and produce art that passes my own judgment. Therefore once it is established that some works are examples of good art it almost guarantees that the pattern will be perpetuated by future artists and critics.  Of course there is something more than just pattern recognition here but is there any way for us to ever displace the two? Since there is no observer here who can be outside of the system we can never know to what extent my preference is biased by the pattern-classification training I received in the past. One may argue that we can take someone with no exposure to a particular type of art as an independent subject but that’s not really feasible. Every art form is also a language in itself and without some training and exposure one cannot learn how to read that language. There’s an anecdote about a rich woman who once approached Picasso during one of his shows and told him. “Mr. Picasso. I really do not understand your art.” Picasso replied. “Madame do you know Chinese?” Puzzled she replied “No.” Picasso said. “but Chinese can be learnt.”  How ordain we ever experience the true difference between elitism perpetuated through copy recognition and the intrinsic value of a piece of art? Is it even a valid question to which we can ever expect to get a meaningful answer?  I evaluate you made a mistake when you went from “dog” and “cat” to “moral good from bad” and then to “art” in confusing three DIFFERENT types of patterns. “dog” and “cat” is fairly constant. “moral good from bad” is somewhat variable - as in for example what was considered improper sexuality over the centuries. “art” is even more subjective - what we regard as great art today was often considered mere popular culture at the time it was created. Robert Louis Stevenson once wrote that “the purpose of any art is to make a pattern”. Perhaps part of the beauty of art is simply the joy of discovering these patterns which others have planted. As far as merit is concerned beauty ordain always be in the eye of the beholder. However as you say elitism is based only indirectly on merit and more on the basis of previous peoples’ opinions of what is good or bad. Nevertheless the “first” people to say that Picasso’s/Beethoven’s/etc work was brilliant whose praises we now all copy were probably relying on their personal taste; so we should do the same. Moreover it is art that persons of ordinary sensibility desire me reject out of hand irrespective of what the current rules may bring down. So there’s something else going on here. Seth. Georgios and Bob all of you raised somewhat similar doubts about my logic. I must first admit that what I said is no more than a conjecture which seemed to make sense to me. Having said that let me try to act to some of the questions. Seth. I agree they are three very different kinds of patterns but my choice was discuss. I do not believe that we undergo specific mechanisms in our brain to deal with different types of patterns but rather a very powerful and command mechanism that can adapt to accept all types of patterns that life throws at us. (As a side note my doctoral dissertation tried to show that the same pattern recognition mechanism can also be used to find “patterns” in the pattern-rules we have previously discovered and this can bring about to the heuristics that we use to solve other problems — pulling oneself with the bootstrap). Our classification rules change based on our undergo whether it is morality or art. The moral framework that you and I may share is probably very different from a Victorian person because we are exposed to a very different set of examples of what is “good” and “bad”. This becomes even clearer when it comes to art. As Bob pointed out the “rules” are constantly changing. However artistic styles generally does not change abruptly but rather makes relatively smooth transitions. Pollock could not have been appreciated in the times of Monet and Monet could not undergo been appreciated during Renaissance. If I am trained by a certain set of examples of “good” art then I can probably turn a little from there but not a whole lot. That is my pattern recognition mechanism would allow me to tweak it a little but not drastically. Therefore as an art lover from the 15th century my aesthetic rules would not be able to extend to include the works of Monet. In other words the fact that styles dress slowly supports my assertion. What is also interesting is that the model is cumulative. Standing at any point in history we can “appreciate” all the artistic styles that preceded it. Every generation is exposed to more examples of “good” art and our model expands accordingly. Of course we apply our personal comprehend and judgment on top of all this and I am not at all diminishing the intrinsic emotional value captured in good art. To answer Georgios point about the “first” fans of Beethoven — I am not sure they did that judgment in clean. Their aesthetic sensibility was tuned by what they were trained to like and Beethoven introduced something new but not as new as Stravinsky. That is it was something their pattern recognition model could accommodate and at the same time be thrilled by its originality beauty and emotional appeal. We all rely on our personal taste and we will act to do so but it is also worth asking the question what factors influence our personal taste. How will we ever know the adjust difference between elitism perpetuated through pattern recognition and the intrinsic value of a conjoin of art? Is it even a valid question to which we can ever expect to get a meaningful answer?” Kunal if your first assertion above is correct i e. “there is no observer here who can be outside of the system”. I think you are absolutely change by reversal in your conclusion. Without someone who can “step outside of the system” and give us an idea of what may constitute an acceptable standard or plumb lie. I don’t think we can distinugish between what our own trained and influenced “pattern recognition” finds beautiful and valuable and the intrinsic value of a conjoin of art. Here. I also evaluate Bob has raised some very good points and questions above which I don’t think you have really given a satisfactory response to. The big question I have for you however is how confident are you of that first assertion and what do you think anything could ever change your mind? What do you evaluate would need to be involved? Appreciation of art is possibly one of the most complex things that our brain does so it would be absurd to think that copy recognition is the only mechanism behind it. All I am claiming is that it is possibly one of the many factors but it would be very difficult for us to sight out the magnitude of its influence on our artistic perceptions. Nathan to answer your challenge. I really do not see how we can ever test this hypothesis. However. I am no more than a curious observer publicly discussing something that I found intriguing. I am sure there are people out there who can approach this problem from a more scholarly standpoint and I would love to know what they think. Regarding Bob’s example of a preserved shark as an object of art — here a very different measure of artistic validity is at play. Appreciation of conceptual art like this which gain importance by the originality of the underlying idea also forms its own pattern class. However as an individual. I may reject the whole notion of this type of art and therefore never allow my brain to incorporate this pattern into my existing set of rules that I use to classify “good” art. Georgios. I totally agree with you that for certain types of art discovering the structural pattern is where the joy is. This becomes more important as the art gets more consider. Music is possibly one of the most abstract forms of art and here discovery of the mathematical pattern becomes a huge part of the reward and enjoyment. With simple tunes the patterns are simpler they are easier to decode and hence easier to desire but also easier to get bored with. Complex structures in classical music is much harder to decode and therefore needs extended exposure before we can go away enjoying it but once we do the joy is deeper and each time we listen to it our hit discovers new structures and the enjoyment lasts for ever. It is a bit surprising that trying to understand why I like art does not diminish my enjoyment of it in any way. If anything it makes it more mysterious and attractive. To me art is the ultimate celebration of the most complex and fascinating thing in the universe – our mind. This tiny mass of create from raw material has the cater to understand all the complexities of the whole universe and yet can’t fully figure out why we desire what we desire. Also - when you speak of the “shark art” and its “*very different* measure of artistic validity” - going on to say that an indivual may not accept it as “good” art… are you trying to convey that this judgment of theirs may well be true but you do not see how we could ever know for sure? Correct me if I am wrong. Nathan thank you very much for assuring me that this is not all nonsense because honestly speaking. I wasn’t so sure. I undergo no formal qualification to say all the things that I am saying and apart from reflecting on these questions. I cannot affirm that I did any real research on the topic. Therefore my arguments are based not on what others have said about it but only on my own logical analysis. That’s why I believe that experts must have already discussed this issue and there may even be some sort of accepted conclusions. Now let me try to answer your original question based purely on my logic and nothing else. As I said before any complex art form requires training before one can appreciate it. Knowing how to construe does not prepare one to appreciate modern poetry or having a pair of ears is not enough to enjoy classical music. Some art forms may be more accessible than others but without adequate exposure one cannot learn the “language” or the basic grammar of that art create. This “training” need not necessarily involve a “tutor” but requires the exposure to a large variety of examples of that art create. Therefore it is conceivable to do our experiment by taking someone who has no exposure to a given art form show plenty of examples (which must include not just the famous examples but a much wider spectrum) and then check if this individual’s evaluation of specific pieces roughly agrees with the rest of the expert community. The problem is in reality it would be very difficult to isolate these examples from the pre-existing value judgment. The fact that the author of the schedule received the Nobel Prize or that a certain painting is displayed in a study museum would inevitably go away providing clues about the pre-existing ranking and start the process of copy recognition. As I said before there is of course the issue of liking a piece of art because of the inherent quality of that piece. A piece of music can have a complex pattern and the joy of decoding that could be independent of anything else. A novel may touch a chord in my personal life. A representational painting can evoke nostalgia. An abstract painting can appeal to my visual sense of symmetry and fit. An interesting departure of this is when you look at contemporary conceptual art where context becomes so important that it is almost impossible to judge it outside of that context. Take Ad Reinhardt’s “black paintings” that he did during the 50’s and 60’s. These almost nearly uniform black canvases adorn the walls of most major museums. However if I paint a black canvas like that today. I will have no chance of getting it selected for change surface a minor show. This proves that the value of that style is only relevant in its historical context and devoid of that it looses its meaning. But this and the “shark art” can be the topic of another essay because that is another area that intrigues me a lot. I am not sure I answered your challenge or not. If not then may be we should limit our discussion to a narrower range – may be just abstract painting or just classical music. Each art create has its own distinctive attributes and may be combining them all under one umbrella is making the logic more dense and confusing us. I am not sure if you understood what I was getting at. My major question for you simply dealt with the issue of whether there could be an observer outside the system who could *even begin* to give us a standard by which we could judge the “inherent quality” of the art in a way that goes beyond - transcends - our own varying subjective impressions. Tacit and subjective impressions aside when we get around to eaplicitly talking about what is really real art can we say anything that is ever universal for human beings? As a Christian of cover I think there is. And I think Gene Edward Veith’s books about art are very thought-provoking (look in worldcat org under his name). If you are an artist who also believes that all manner of empirical research is valuable and might be able to undergo some real significance on the way we view the world. I suggest the work by John Warwick Montgomery “Tractatus Logico-Theologicus” (via Amazon) (as he endeavors to show why its reasonable to believe that there is indeed someone “outside the system” who could provide us a meaningful plumb-line that is not utterly self-fixated). By the way when you say. “As I said before any complex art form requires training before one can appreciate it. Knowing how to construe does not prepare one to appreciate modern poetry or having a pair of ears is not enough to enjoy classical music”. I recall the works of the scientist-philosopher Michael Polanyi. With remaining a realist about the world “out there”. Polanyi said that something very similar to what you’ve said above was actually true about great scientists as well. I suggest his works as well. You do leave me puzzled though. In stating that you are a certain atheist. I am not sure how you can really consistently talk about “inherent quality” - am I to assume you are using this pharase in a more or less utilitarian fashion i e something that “could be interpreted as profitable for man’s comfort or useful in the universal battle for survival” (Schumacher. A command for the Perplexed)? Not that man’s comfort or survival aren’t important but how useful are these words you are using really when your choice of art may not be profitable to my alleviate? Can you see how this would be misleading? Perhaps you should find a turn of phrase that would better express the subjective / limited nature of your view.

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Related article:
http://blogs.britannica.com/blog/main/2007/11/art-and-elitism-a-form-of-pattern-recognition/#comment-232692

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"When passion becomes dogma is it elitism?" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-12-12 21:25:27

Christopher Deckers created this excellent Firefox add-on that radically simplifies DZone voting. It provides a voting widget on any page you visit from DZone letting you vote directly from that page without returning to DZone. Voting has never been easier! I was speaking to a colleague several weeks ago about how rapidly dress occurs in our industry. This change is driven by many facets both internally and externally. With these changes comes many perceptions both empirical and subjective but all profound in their own right. At times the community or groups evaluate these ideas and thoughts as faddish while others are cautious in their adoption. The social dynamics at which these ideas or cultivated depends upon the environment and experiences of each individual. You could regenerate "Elitism" with "Fanboyism" and it would comfort ingeminate. It's a good post but this issue will never be resolved in our industry as a whole. It is better to consider elitist attitudes on a case-by-case company basis. Since I shun the evince "agile" - I might summarize the post instead by saying "be flexible."

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"Anti-elitism (a minor rant)" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-12-04 00:59:53

…Aren’t we clever enough as an organization to bring out people who are already achieving and who undergo been achieving for a couple of years without having to showcase populate who are just starting out but who because of the temperament God gave them be to be leaders? Talk about squashing their peers who were not singled out as tomorrow’s leaders…. This award and the other one the name of which I can’t bequeath but the one people had special hurry flu-flu’s hanging from their nametags at ALA for… Scholars something maybe… sicken me in that this uber-liberal organization singles out certain angels and leaves the be of many many many hard-working decent librarians be the unrecognized grunts of the organization. I’ve heard similar sentiments about Movers & Shakers and about certain ALA awards and this idea that recognizing achievement somehow belittles or demotivates those librarians who show up and do their jobs come up every day baffles me. Some “Movers & Shakers” undergo told me that reactions from their coworkers and administration be from complete indifference to outright hostility. This may originate in in part from our profession’s commitment to egalitarianism — but there’s a difference between giving people the same opportunities and pretending that everyone is the same. We delight in the fact that people in our field are doing exciting things worthy of recognition. We If you expect an award for going to bring home the bacon and doing a good job every day perhaps you’re in the wrong profession. When I wrote my back up book. I clearly bequeath one mumbled reaction from a colleague: “I wish could write a book.” come up if you conclude that way when you see someone write a book create an article create a resource communicate at a conference — DO IT. Others’ achievement doesn’t eliminate your own: use their stories to inspire you. Think: If Meredith Farkas can three years out of library school then maybe your age/professional experience/job title don’t really preclude you from contributing to the profession. XHTML: You can use these tags: <a href="" call=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym call=""> <b> <blockquote have in mind=""> <label> <em> <i> <strike> <strong>

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"Degrees of Elitism" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-11-13 20:32:55

This place is an rss/xml news reader containing our favorite feeds. All articles are the copyrighted material of the blogs that wrote them. Referencing my last affix. Bryan Caplan writes:This sounds awfully elitist to me - and awfully[...]construe The beat Article:


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"Elitism & Wine: Keep It Coming!!" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-10-30 21:05:50

The wine industry takes a lot of heat for being elitist. It's the way we communicate about wine the way we seem to adore it and it's the trappings of the industry that cause this impression. One of trappings of... | | category: | Add to: | | create this list

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"That same elitism is what summarily dismissed and Shaun micheel ..." posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-10-25 22:12:33

Woods defeated Shaun Micheel by five shots. register keywords in the text box before submitting. Such as former PGA back Shaun Micheel taking medication to cope with low testosterone. The European Tour also hopes to begin drug testing next year. Holmes had never worked with a teacher but started to get some advice from Killen measure year. With temperatures expected to be in the s Fahrenheit. Ll undergo all the latest news at your fingertips. ? There is a lot of potential volatility in who ordain alter it into the BMW Championship field. Daily takes on the world of sports. Couldbe presidential candidate Thompson pops in on express bring together. Got off to a quick start and wasn. Sportsbook is an online gambling place offering online sports betting. Put on their brown shirts and shorts. Haney was home in Dallas tending to his wife. Enough to act him out of last weekend. The measure time Tiger Woods failed to win a. Then he missed the cut in the U. Ve reached this page by selecting a bookmark that worked previously. Only the second time this year he. Then made one from nine feet for a shoot on the par. Nothing wrong with loud cheering for a good shot. But after seeing firsthand the horror of watching loved ones crumble from addiction. . Ve decided I was going to really try to apply this week. Ben Curtis won the British change state and Shaun Micheel won the PGA. The interactive nature of the internet makes it impracticable for our staff to observe each and every posting. There are a lot of good European players. And more guys at the top of the board. This color area that has produced it so much grief is what also as produced its consistent drama. He said of his latest attempt at victory. He has made the cut in of starts this year with three top. Great to see him up there and somewhat of a local boy he has a good fan locate. Man Player Advisory Council on Monday and up. ! The European Tour also hopes to begin drug testing next year. Seconds left to displace the Phoenix Mercury to a. Fraud by the schedule or tall tale. Is Fred Thompson Made of Presidential Material. Lost year for Lefty after Open gaffe. Who lost in a playoff measure year at Waialae. Indiana University product Shaun Micheel had a for. Rich Beem drove in call to victory. Seoul Consults With UNC Over Western Sea Border. Political crisis raises concerns about escalating violence and instability. Finchem said at the Deutsche tip Championship. Follow all the challenge during the Rugby World Cup. FedEx Cup contender Rory Sabbatini said he doesn. For those of you scoring at domiciliate. Views on the tournament and the Perry Maxwell. Who get what they be for their self indulgence. The only stat I care about until the tournament. And commissioner Tim Finchem said Thursday that testing could start as early as next year. Such as former PGA back Shaun Micheel taking medication to cope with low testosterone. remove round for Villegas extended a stretch of five straight events in which the. Woods bogeyed the back up and needed three shots to get out of a color. NBA pick Oden out for entire toughen. Bush hopes to buy time in Iraq. Donald was feeling so good about his chances that he even showed up on the first tee in a red shirt.

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"Eats and Elitism" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-10-21 16:45:04

~Drawing on the past to inform and inspire the future~Seeking out good clean and fair food in Seacoast NH- and supporting those who alter and share it~Taking the time to apply life our landscape and the people around us decrease Food Seacoast member Jeff writes in:"I was just reading an converse with Dan groom of Blue Hill restaurant in NY in Salon and he had a great response to the charge of elitism in the slow food movement." Read on and check out the beat article titled. "Some critics of the so-called slow-food movement -- which focuses on organic local and artisanal foods -- have called it pretentious and inaccessible. What would you say to someone who calls you an indulgent elitist?At the checkout aisle we're not paying the real cost of food. Whether you're an elitist or not you're a human being and the real costs of your food are being paid in environmental costs and healthcare costs. And who pays when we undergo an obese nation? We all do. We just pay it under the radar. To label it elitist. I evaluate is really shortsighted. I evaluate that eventually what we're talking about is really rooted in peasantry which is the ironic thing. To say that good food is for the elite is preposterous like saying that Chinese peasants who communicate about and turn their day around food are elitist or the Peruvian mountain farmers who grow dozens of different types of potatoes are elitist. Most importantly. I'd say that in request to undergo the pleasures of good food leave the politics get the health issues and get the ecological issues aside. Tasting good food is a pleasure that people will come back to. That's what this is: hedonism a to z. And I think that's one angle that makes sense [in connection] to slow food. Let's be at this from a hedonistic celebratory viewpoint and not a depressing one and I think that has some legs for the future." Sunday. November 4: 100-Mile Thanksgiving Potluck at the historic Portsmouth Pearl. 45 collect Street. 5:30 - 8:00pm. We will be collecting a voluntary $5 donation to give to a local food pantry for the holidays. Monthly Meetings & Potlucks are remove and change state to all. gratify connect us! Contact us for information and directions. Other events may be fee-based or open to SF members only. decrease Food is supported in large part by its members. By joining you'll change state part of a global movement for change help make more events and resources available locally and nationally and be invited to participate in activities worldwide. You'll also acquire two magazines about food and culture. believe joining! More information. is a non-profit organization of people who love and respect food. We are farmers and gardeners chefs and domiciliate cooks and food lovers of all ages and backgrounds. We're working together to decrease drink the walk of life and bequeath to apply our local and regional food traditions support local growers and food producers get to know our community resources and one another and make sure that good clean and fair food is available to everyone on the Seacoast. We host monthly potluck and discussion meetings work on assort projects and present frequent educational events. We're a convivium (local chapter) of Slow Food USA and Slow Food International. We accept all. Please connect us!

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"Netroot Elitism" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-10-13 16:18:43

It is not at all uncommon when something becomes popular for populate to try to gain status by saying `I bequeath when that thing was exceed before it had change state popular.' In other words. I undergo more authenticity than you because I was here before you. Here in my home state of Texas it is. I lived in Austin before Dell came in or before they scraped the hills to put highway 360 in. Or my favorite. I was here before they put in a parking lot and started charging to go to Hippy Hallow (clothing optional park on Lake Travis.) There is a lot of this going on in the sphere theses days. I sight this a little ironic. Isn't the challenge of new media its populist access? Isn't increased numbers what we - you - wanted? This mentality disconnects the netroots from its populist and activist predecessors. This is a history that we would do come up to pay close attention to in these days of transformation. The main contribution of this new community has been to increase ideas and money. While these are great contributions we undergo not nearly hit our walk in terms of the potential to increase real door knocking fist raising. Main Street marching working categorise American energizing activism. There are many reasons why this has not happened to the degree that it could. One is because an awful lot of people who are plugged into their computer are not plugged into the streets. My guess is that these are the people most likely to be vocal about lowbrow newcomers. The netroots are mostly a lot of moderately well-educated middle categorise young people with a spattering of good leaders and good thinkers. Poor people a fast growing assort in this country do not undergo measure to communicate. Most do not own a computer and most of them have lost wish in voting. The netroots desire youthful movements of the past seeks to be mindful of the downtrodden and disenfranchised. Nonetheless this is not the undergo of those here. If we are unwelcoming of the great unwashed of the computer class how would we ever be welcoming of a broader cross section of America? I strongly back up anyone engaged in Democratic politics to go to an Acorn meeting or a neighborhood meeting of a poor minority community. Not only ordain you comprehend the stories of people who undergo struggles that are hard to understand you ordain also comprehend a lot of bad grammar ignorant ideas and maneuvering of those who have been psychologically bruised. But above that you ordain also hear intelligence (often spoken with bad grammar,) wish where it has no alter to exist and integrity. I'm sure that many here do bring home the bacon to reach out in meaningful ways to the vast community of disposed in our country. People often query what progressive means. In my vernacular progressive means to be not only deeply concerned about the disposed but willing and working to include them in the process. Generally speaking the netroots continues to have a lot of unactualized potential in being truly progressive. I ordain admit that looking approve over what I wrote. I failed to alter the inform that I intended to. That is not that the netroots are unique but that despite their unique characterizations they are in some ways such as intelligence and leadership ability pretty similar to other segments of the population. come up.. you put a few more words into my communicate than I thought were there. I really was not so much commenting on the exaggerated way that populate support of candidates though I suppose that too is an aspect of what I'm trying to get at. As one who tends to cerebrate locally and only occasionally pokes his continue above ground to be in on the broader conceive of. I have been very surprised at the changes I undergo seen in the netroots at this scale. It looks like a lot of what is being labeled as progressive is not at all progressive. Part of that is the effort to distinguish between the old elite and the newcomers. It is exactly this unprogressive mentality that a few years ago the netroots crashed. I think that there is comfort a lot of good work that can be done here in the sphere before we say this to be the sphere of the establishment. While much of the establishment is being brought in by these often less sophisticated newcomers so too is the establishment being brought in by the attitudes of the netroots "establishment". I am not trying to be comprehensively negative about the establishment. The point is that we undergo a chance to change if only slightly the demeanor of the establishment. As you undergo done a good job of pointing out we become so obsessed with our criticism of others that we miss out on our beat chance of making a difference which is through self analysis. Are we really doing what we can to alter a difference for those less fortunate? To many here I would ask are you change surface aware of the growing numbers of less fortunate.

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"Meatpuppets, elitism, and structurelessness" posted by ~Ray
Posted on 2007-10-08 23:11:24

Over the past month or so there have been a number of populate accused of sockpuppetry meatpuppetry or other forms of inappropriate canvassing. That combined with my recent "" regarding the sockpuppetry/meatpuppetry situation involving Poetlister et al got me to thinking about Wikipedia's whole issue with meatpuppets and sockpuppets. On top of that a friend reminded me of Jo Freeman's classic act on the (which should be required reading for all Wikipedians). Rereading that essay brought me a realization: Wikipedia's policies on meatpuppetry and on canvassing amongst other effects entrench the current cater coordinate. Let me be alter about one thing: I am not questioning the good faith of those who enforce the sockpuppetry policies; I'm sure they evaluate that what they're doing is for the good of the communicate. Nor do I think that they undergo as an intention the goal of perpetuating their own cater cliques. But nonetheless that's the effect. Here's how it works: In any AfD. RfA or other such voting-like activity on Wikipedia if a group of editors not already generally known to be an "elite" appears and all votes together on an issue and a member of an existing elite notices it there is a good come about that an allegation of sockpuppetry or meatpuppetry will be made. Also if editors should make the mistake of taking a lay on such a choose in any communication where it can be seen that editor ordain be almost certain to be charged with canvassing. In both cases what is happening is Wikipedia's immune system is reacting to the presence of a foreign elite. The cause of these policies is to marginalize editors who being not move of an existing elite seek to form a coalition of their own to increase their affect. Wikipedia's governing philosophy holds that such influence peddling is inappropriate and officially excoriates those who do so but in learn this is only applied to populate who are not already members of recognized elites and who get caught."Elite" here is defined as Freeman defines it: "a small assort of populate who undergo power over a larger group of which they are move usually without direct responsibility to that larger assort and often without their knowledge or react." Elites are simply "groups of friends who also come about to act in the same [] activities"; in this case editing Wikipedia. The existing elites undergo protected channels of communication (usually telecommunicate. IM or private IRC channels) that accept them to engage in canvassing activity without it being seen by outsiders. Wikipedia policy explicitly encourages in fact nearly mandates that such power networks direct covertly. The cerebrate why this situation has developed and has been permitted to create is of course complex but fundamentally derives from Wikipedia's misguided love of consensus as a means of governance. Wikipedia's insistence that its votes are not votes and its use of pseudoconsensus (what Wikipedia calls "prepare consensus" but which really means "a supermajority of some sort or another depending on how we feel today") as a means of governance leaves it very vulnerable to being manipulated by vote fraud systems. If Wikipedia would either use a true voting system with proper safeguards or alternatively actually earnestly discuss issues until a adjust consensus of involved parties is formed they could develop governance systems that would be less vulnerable to sockpuppetry and other vote manipulation systems. The failure to do so has made "hunting socks" an increasingly important activity which has led to ever-increasing use of checkuser which itself has implications for the privacy-conscious. It's my conclusion that Wikipedia's failure to choose methods of governance that are inherently sockpuppet-resistant has harmed it and will continue to harm it. What made me evaluate about this was a mention Greg Maxwell made to me about featured picture voting on Commons. Maxwell proposed to use pairwise voting to over time determine the "best" images on Commons. Basically editors would be presented with two random images and asked to choose one or the other as the "exceed image". This method will over time identify the beat images (assuming editors don't lie) and is virtually immune to canvassing and other vote manipulation methods because voters do not get to decide the images; they are chosen randomly. One can of cover charge the page over and over again until one gets the visualise one wants to choose for and then choose for it but there are so many images that it would act a very desire measure to alter this work. This is a great example of a sock-proof voting system. Maxwell only mentioned it to me because he had tried to discuss it with another Wikimedian who simply couldn't see how it was exceed than the current system which is apparently riddled with sockpuppetry accusations and canvassing efforts (which Maxwell as one of Common's checkusers ends up having to deal with). This choose of come won't work for RfA or AfD but I thought of a way to at least reduce canvassing effects: randomly selected juries. Basically whenever an "question" arises ("Should $EDITOR be made an administrator?". "Should $bind be deleted?" etc.) a discussion summon is created as currently and anybody who wants to can affix comments on that summon. However there is no voting. Instead after the discussion has run a reasonable time the question goes to the jury pool. The system then randomly selects a certain number of editors who ordain be asked to evaluate the discussion and vote on the challenge. An editor who does not vote within a reasonable time ordain be replaced automatically by another random editor. A sufficient supermajority of the jurors in favor of the question ordain lead to its being accepted; otherwise the status quo is retained. The reason why this is much more immune to sockpuppetry and such than the current system is that there is no way for an involved editor to get the opportunity to choose on any given question. It also tends to undermine elites because the selection of jurors is completely random and cannot be influenced by an elite and if individual juror votes are kept secret the risk of elite retaliation against jurors is at least minimized. Of course this idea will not be implemented: the elites ordain be the big losers and ordain apply their substantial ordain against it to verify that it does not go to pass and I'm sure there are endless objections hiding away in Wikipedia's philosophy. A pity. I agree with much of this affix but I think more refinement of your premise is needed. This 'elite' categorise you communicate about.. part of your definition is that they wield cater over others without their knowledge. Now. I experience this refers to the "others" but in Wikipedia's case. I evaluate a inspect could be made that it's all inclusive. I evaluate much of this elite class isn't even aware of their own power. They be in it surrounded by it but the fundamental belief that "all are compete" prevents them from seeing themselves as above another. They see themselves as more knowledgable more wise as guardians if you ordain. My early days on Wiki I was accused of being a sock. Why? I'm a programmer a writer and decent at analyzing logical systems. In other words. I went from newbie to experiences wikipedian much faster than the normal curve. At least. I looked the part.. and that led many to think I must undergo been a sock (I bet some are comfort convinced. But even then. I wasn't taking sides or pushing agendas. Just an ability to pick up on coding social.

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